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Filter wizard: noise in Sallen Key vs. Multiple Feedback

Hi,

I am designing a 2-stage amplifer/filter with a high pass (>10kHz) and low pass (<100kHz) and an overall gain of 1000-2000 (gain ~30-40V/V per stage). My input impedance is approximately 5k (piezo transducer), which limits the smallest resistors a bit for noise reduction.

In the Filter Wizard, when comparing the noise simulation figures, it seems that Multiple-feedback topologies have significantly less noise (e.g. a peak of 100nV compared to >1uV for comparable Sallen-Key). By tuning resistor/capacitor values, the noise spectrum can be made quite flat and very low compared to Sallen Key.

Is this a real effect, or just an artefact of the simulation?

This video: Filtering 101: Sallen-Key vs. Multiple Feedback - YouTube  by an Analog Devices engineer says that the noise gain of Multiple Feedback is slightly higher.

If the Filter Wizard is right, could someone explain the much lower noise?

Independent of this issue, what would be your recommendation for the two stages to minimise noise if I want to limit it to 2 opamps? Would it be better to add a 3rd opamp as an input buffer (accepting additional board space) to interface with the high input impedance, and reduce resistor sizes in the following stages?

What is the impact of a virtual ground on noise in your experience? I built the above design with the eval kit using virtual ground, and noticed slightly higher noise when the transducer is referenced to GND (9mV RMS) than referenced to VGND (4.7mV RMS).

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  • Hi Matt,

    thanks for the detailed response! Also, great work on the Filter Wizard, it's a really nice and useful tool. I think point 1) and 2) make sense in my context, point 3) probably less considering the high gain. Also, I tried to reduce resistor values until they were similar to the MF filter but within the limits the noise peak will always be higher.

    What's also nice about the MF is that the shape of the noise spectrum changes with different values - to some extent that allows shifting the noise outside of the required signal bandwidth.

    I think I will design my board with the multi-feedback filters, and try to add a first amplifier stage if there's space. I actually built a 30db noninverting gain stage on the eval kit yesterday, and it has slightly lower noise but not a major difference (using an OPA365, I couldn't get the ADA4897 stable in this configuration for some reason). However, it has only lower noise if the piezo transducer is between the input and VGND - if it's between input and GND the noise is actually a lot higher compared to the MF Highpass. I guess the noise is from any small discrepancies between GND and VGND that are amplified. On the eval kit there are fairly long traces between the VGND buffer and the amplifier inputs. Maybe it also has something to do with the high capacitance of the transducer (>1nF).

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  • Hi Matt,

    thanks for the detailed response! Also, great work on the Filter Wizard, it's a really nice and useful tool. I think point 1) and 2) make sense in my context, point 3) probably less considering the high gain. Also, I tried to reduce resistor values until they were similar to the MF filter but within the limits the noise peak will always be higher.

    What's also nice about the MF is that the shape of the noise spectrum changes with different values - to some extent that allows shifting the noise outside of the required signal bandwidth.

    I think I will design my board with the multi-feedback filters, and try to add a first amplifier stage if there's space. I actually built a 30db noninverting gain stage on the eval kit yesterday, and it has slightly lower noise but not a major difference (using an OPA365, I couldn't get the ADA4897 stable in this configuration for some reason). However, it has only lower noise if the piezo transducer is between the input and VGND - if it's between input and GND the noise is actually a lot higher compared to the MF Highpass. I guess the noise is from any small discrepancies between GND and VGND that are amplified. On the eval kit there are fairly long traces between the VGND buffer and the amplifier inputs. Maybe it also has something to do with the high capacitance of the transducer (>1nF).

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